Most Active Speakers 2023

Sessionize proudly presents the list of the most active speakers in the year 2023!

  • 758 speakers
  • Auto-generated
Dwayne Natwick

Dwayne Natwick

Dwayne is the CEO and Owner of Captain Hyperscaler, LLC. He was previously the Global Principal Cloud Security Lead for Eviden, an atos business. He is also a Microsoft MVP for Security and Azure, and an author, trainer, and product manager with over 30 years of experience in the IT industry. He is certified in AKYLADE Cyber Resilience, AI Security, and Risk Management; ISC2 for CC, CGRC, CCSP, CSSLP, SSCP, CISSP-ISSMP, CISSP-ISSAP, and CISSP; ISACA CRISC, CISM, CISA; EC-Council C|SCU and Associate C|CISO; CompTIA Cloud+; AI CERTs Ethics, Executive, Everyone, Prompt Engineer, Educator, Project Manager; CSA CCSK, and in multiple Azure and M365 roles, including Microsoft Cybersecurity Architect Expert, Azure Solution Architect Expert, AWS Solution Architect Associate, Azure Administrator Associate, Microsoft Security Analyst Associate, Microsoft Identity and Access Administrator Associate, Microsoft Information Protection Administrator Associate, Azure Security Engineer Associate, and Microsoft 365 Security Administrator Associate. He also has his AWS Solutions Architect Associate and PMI Project Management Professional.

In addition to creating curriculum, training, and blog writing, Dwayne is also an APMG Accredited Trainer for ISACA, an Authorized Trainer for AKYLADE, a Microsoft Certified Trainer and Regional Lead and an ISC2 Authorized Trainer. Dwayne has also authored three books for Packt Publishing that are available on Amazon at https://aka.ms/dwaynesbooks.

Dwayne is the CEO and Owner of Captain Hyperscaler, LLC. He was previously the Global Principal Cloud Security Lead for Eviden, an atos business. He is also a Microsoft MVP for Security and Azure, and an author, trainer, and product manager with ove... Show more

Zoe Steinkamp

Zoe Steinkamp

I’m Zoe Steinkamp, a Developer Advocate at ClickHouse, with a strong foundation in front-end software engineering. My mission is to empower developers by enhancing their experience with ClickHouse’s high-performance database and real-time analytics capabilities. I also have a growing interest in data science. In my spare time, I love to travel and tend to my garden. Let’s connect on LinkedIn—I’m eager to exchange insights and knowledge at both virtual and in-person events!

I’m Zoe Steinkamp, a Developer Advocate at ClickHouse, with a strong foundation in front-end software engineering. My mission is to empower developers by enhancing their experience with ClickHouse’s high-performance database and real-time analytics c... Show more

Arindam Mitra

Arindam Mitra

I am a Microsoft MVP (Most Valuable Professional) in Developer Technologies & Azure | Azure Cloud Solutions & DevOps Architect | Technical Blogger & Speaker Focused on Cloud Adoption, Architecture, Automation, Build and Run in Azure.

I am a Microsoft MVP (Most Valuable Professional) in Developer Technologies & Azure | Azure Cloud Solutions & DevOps Architect | Technical Blogger & Speaker Focused on Cloud Adoption, Architecture, Automation, Build and Run in Azure. Show more

Merab Tato Kutalia

Merab Tato Kutalia

Senior Engineering Manager. He’s an experienced international speaker, mentor and podcast host as well as a running enthusiast.

Senior Engineering Manager. He’s an experienced international speaker, mentor and podcast host as well as a running enthusiast. Show more

Himanshu Singh

Himanshu Singh

Himanshu is a Full Stack Kotlin Engineer specializing in Android development. Recognized as a Google Developer Expert (GDE) for Android, he is an active speaker and content creator. Passionate about community building, Himanshu loves mentoring aspiring developers and helping them transition into the tech world.

Himanshu is a Full Stack Kotlin Engineer specializing in Android development. Recognized as a Google Developer Expert (GDE) for Android, he is an active speaker and content creator. Passionate about community building, Himanshu loves mentoring aspiri... Show more

Marco Dal Pino

Marco Dal Pino

Marco Dal Pino is working in IT for more than 30 years as Developer, Team Leader, PM and Cloud Architect.
He mostly experienced Microsoft dev Platforms around .NET, for LOB, Desktop, Mobile and embedded apps.
He is a Microsoft Certified Trainer and a Speaker at the main technical conferences all around the world.
He is part of the staff of DotNetToscana a community focused on Microsoft technologies.
He received many awards from IT companies as independent Advisor like:
Microsoft MVP, Intel BlackBelt & Innovator, Nokia DevChamp, Hackster Live Ambassador
He works in Microsoft as a Senior Technical Consultant.

Marco Dal Pino is working in IT for more than 30 years as Developer, Team Leader, PM and Cloud Architect. He mostly experienced Microsoft dev Platforms around .NET, for LOB, Desktop, Mobile and embedded apps. He is a Microsoft Certified Trainer and... Show more

Andrew Pruski

Andrew Pruski

Andrew is a Microsoft Data Platform MVP and Docker Captain who helps organise Data Ceili and EightKB.

He is interested in all things database/kubernetes/container related and shares his passion for these topics by speaking at events across the world.

Originally from Wales but now exploring Ireland.

You can find him on Bluesky @dbafromthecold.com and blogging at dbafromthecold.com

Andrew is a Microsoft Data Platform MVP and Docker Captain who helps organise Data Ceili and EightKB. He is interested in all things database/kubernetes/container related and shares his passion for these topics by speaking at events across the wor... Show more

Sven Peters

Sven Peters

Sven Peters, AI evangelist at Atlassian, has been studying trends in software development for the last 15 years, uncovering the cultural and technical attributes to help development teams work effectively and drive innovation. He has 20 years of experience in writing code, leading teams, and sharing his experience with thousands of developers at countless conferences in 25+ countries.

Sven Peters, AI evangelist at Atlassian, has been studying trends in software development for the last 15 years, uncovering the cultural and technical attributes to help development teams work effectively and drive innovation. He has 20 years of expe... Show more

Henning Schwentner

Henning Schwentner

Henning loves programming in high quality. He lives this passion as coder, coach, and consultant at WPS – Workplace Solutions. There he helps teams to structure their monoliths or to build new systems from the beginning with a sustainable architecture. Microservices or self-contained systems are often the result. Henning is author of “Domain Storytelling” (Addison-Wesley 2022), “Domain-Driven Transformation” (Addison-Wesley 2024) and the www.LeasingNinja.io.

Henning loves programming in high quality. He lives this passion as coder, coach, and consultant at WPS – Workplace Solutions. There he helps teams to structure their monoliths or to build new systems from the beginning with a sustainable architectur... Show more

Jan Vidar Elven

Jan Vidar Elven

Jan Vidar Elven is a Senior Cloud Platform & Security Architect working at Microsoft Partner Evidi AS in Norway. He is a Microsoft MVP in Security, an active speaker and blogger, and has more than 25 years’ experience inside IT infrastructure management and architecting solutions, working with Cloud & Datacenter, specializing in Azure, Microsoft Entra, Active Directory, Enterprise Mobility, Identity & Access Management, Identity Governance, Service Management, Operations Management and Automation cross On-Premise and Azure environments.

Jan Vidar Elven is a Senior Cloud Platform & Security Architect working at Microsoft Partner Evidi AS in Norway. He is a Microsoft MVP in Security, an active speaker and blogger, and has more than 25 years’ experience inside IT infrastructure managem... Show more

Gerrit Grunwald

Gerrit Grunwald

Gerrit Grunwald is a software engineer that loves coding for around 40 years already. He is a true believer in open source and he is an active member of the Java community, where he founded and leads the Java User Group Münster (Germany), he is a JavaOne rockstar and a Java Champion. He is a speaker at conferences and user groups internationally and writes for several magazines.

Gerrit Grunwald is a software engineer that loves coding for around 40 years already. He is a true believer in open source and he is an active member of the Java community, where he founded and leads the Java User Group Münster (Germany), he is a Jav... Show more

Danica Fine

Danica Fine

Danica began her career as a software engineer in financial services and pivoted to developer relations, where she focussed primarily on open source technologies such as Apache Kafka® and Apache Flink®. She now leads the open source advocacy efforts at Snowflake, supporting Apache Iceberg™ and Apache Polaris™, serves as a Jupyter Foundation Board member, and is a member of the Apache Software Foundation.

She can be found on X (Bluesky and Mastodon) @TheDanicaFine.

Danica began her career as a software engineer in financial services and pivoted to developer relations, where she focussed primarily on open source technologies such as Apache Kafka® and Apache Flink®. She now leads the open source advocacy efforts ... Show more

Glenn F. Henriksen

Glenn F. Henriksen

Glenn F. Henriksen is a mentor and developer from Norway. As the co-founder and CTO of Justify, he gets to build new legal tools for everyone to use, helping to create better communication and less conflict in relationships. He's continuously exploring new tools, processes and technologies, and improving how he and his fellow developers work with code, tasks and projects. He has been a Microsoft Development MVP, a part of the Microsoft Regional Director program and is an ASP.NET Insider and an Azure Advisor. In the past 25+ years he has co-owned two companies, worked as a consultant, manager, support tech, network admin, developer, architect, technical lead and more, but his favourite things are still swapping code for food and building stuff that makes a difference in people’s lives.

Glenn F. Henriksen is a mentor and developer from Norway. As the co-founder and CTO of Justify, he gets to build new legal tools for everyone to use, helping to create better communication and less conflict in relationships. He's continuously explori... Show more

Mark Rackley

Mark Rackley

Mark is Director of the Microsoft Practice at Protiviti and a 10-year Microsoft MVP with more than 25 years of experience designing and developing software solutions. Mark’s daily responsibilities include forging the direction of solution architecture and development projects for clients while providing the best solutions for clients' unique problems. Mark has a unique ability to breakdown complicated technical topics in a way that are easily consumable by a non-technical audience and engages his audience with humor and real-world stories. As a globally recognized M365 geek, Mark is an active blogger, presenter, author (and bacon aficionado) who is eager to lend his real-world knowledge of SharePoint to all who need it.

In addition to speaking at various SharePoint & Office 365 conferences around the world, Mark is the organizer of The North American Collaboration Summit (www.collabsummit.org) in Branson, Missouri

Mark is Director of the Microsoft Practice at Protiviti and a 10-year Microsoft MVP with more than 25 years of experience designing and developing software solutions. Mark’s daily responsibilities include forging the direction of solution architectur... Show more

Jose Manuel Jurado Diaz

Jose Manuel Jurado Diaz

José Manuel Jurado currently works as SQL Escalation Engineer and Subject Matter Expert in Azure SQL Database at Microsoft Spain. With over 15+ years of experience in SQL Server environments (administration and database development), he is a speaker for internal events at Microsoft and for public events as SQL Saturday, SQL Nexus, TechReady, DotNetConference and Azure BootCamp. In the past, he worked as Project Manager for large Global Retail Company for more than 10 years developing projects using different Microsoft Technologies.

José Manuel Jurado currently works as SQL Escalation Engineer and Subject Matter Expert in Azure SQL Database at Microsoft Spain. With over 15+ years of experience in SQL Server environments (administration and database development), he is a speaker ... Show more

Reid Havens

Reid Havens

As the founder of both (Havens Consulting & Analytic Endeavors) and a Microsoft MVP, Reid is a seasoned professional with a wealth of experience in technology, organizational management, and business analytics. With a Master's Degree in Organizational Development and a background in consulting for Fortune 10, 50, and 500 companies, Reid has the knowledge and expertise to help your organization succeed.

In addition to his corporate experience, Reid is also a highly sought-after instructor, teaching Business Intelligence, reporting, and data visualization at the University of Washington and other universities. His passion for education extends beyond the classroom, as he has co-authored the DP-500 Enterprise Azure Analyst certification exam for Microsoft and developed numerous training curriculums delivered to companies around the world.

As the founder of both (Havens Consulting & Analytic Endeavors) and a Microsoft MVP, Reid is a seasoned professional with a wealth of experience in technology, organizational management, and business analytics. With a Master's Degree in Organizationa... Show more

Douglas Starnes

Douglas Starnes

Douglas Starnes is a technology entrepreneur, content creator and five-time Microsoft Most Valuable Professional in Developer Technologies and the AI Platform in Memphis, TN. Douglas is the founder and director of the Memphis Azure User Group as well as the director of the Memphis Python User Group. He is also on the organizing committee of Scenic City Summit in Chattanooga, TN. A frequent conference and user group speaker, Douglas has delivered more than 80 featured presentations and workshops at more than 40 events over the past 10 years. He holds a Bachelor of Music degree with an emphasis on Music Composition from the University of Memphis.

Douglas Starnes is a technology entrepreneur, content creator and five-time Microsoft Most Valuable Professional in Developer Technologies and the AI Platform in Memphis, TN. Douglas is the founder and director of the Memphis Azure User Group as well... Show more

Ahmed Tikiwa

Ahmed Tikiwa

Ahmed Tikiwa is a Senior Software Engineer at Disney and a Google Developer Expert for Android with over 12 years of software engineering experience and possesses a strong passion for developing world-class applications that can help make a difference. He has experience in frontend and backend systems, where he has built enterprise solutions for major telecommunication companies. He is currently a Senior Software Engineer based in Utrecht, The Netherlands, and an official contributor to Google Developers Dev Library.

Ahmed Tikiwa is a Senior Software Engineer at Disney and a Google Developer Expert for Android with over 12 years of software engineering experience and possesses a strong passion for developing world-class applications that can help make a differenc... Show more

Haniel Croitoru

Haniel Croitoru

Haniel Croitoru is an accomplished Enterprise Architect at Protiviti and Microsoft MVP with over 20 years of experience in Microsoft 365. Since 2003, Haniel has been dedicated to delivering solutions that meet both short-term and long-term business goals using Microsoft 365 workloads, such as Power Platform, SharePoint, Teams, and more. As a leader in the global Protiviti Power Platform practice, Haniel created a Center of Excellence that nurtures an internal team of architects and developers, serving a global clientele across various sectors.

Haniel's commitment to knowledge sharing and community contribution is evident through his active participation in conferences and networking events, where he shares his expertise in modern workplace transformation and optimizing business processes using the Power Platform, coupled with insights into artificial intelligence applications. He has recently made a significant contribution with the publication of "Agile Office 365," a book that explores the application of agile project management methodologies to Office 365 implementations.

In the early stages of his career, Haniel was instrumental in the medical imaging field, notably as a core team member in the orthopedic software division at Merge Healthcare (now part of IBM). During this time, he published four patents and numerous scholarly articles, showcasing a strong foundation in innovation and industry expertise. Haniel holds a Master of Science in Computer Science with a specialty in Computer-Assisted Orthopedic Surgery from Queen’s University and a Master’s Certificate in Project Management from the York Schulich School of Business.

Haniel Croitoru is an accomplished Enterprise Architect at Protiviti and Microsoft MVP with over 20 years of experience in Microsoft 365. Since 2003, Haniel has been dedicated to delivering solutions that meet both short-term and long-term business g... Show more

Fátima Jaydith Blancas

Fátima Jaydith Blancas

Fátima Blancas is the founder and CEO of iTProve Corporation. For the last fourteen years, she has been a consultant on Microsoft Technology, from SharePoint 2007 to SharePoint Online, Office 365, and Microsoft Teams.

She was born and raised, and continues to live, in Mexico City. Fátima is a graduate of the La Salle University, Mexico City Campus. She believes in sharing knowledge to make this world a better place to live in.

She loves to speak about Technology and Education. She has participated as a Guest Speaker at several conferences. She also created the Office 365 Academia Community.
Join her at LinkedIn, Facebook and Twitter.
LinkedIn: fatimablancas
Facebook: /fatimablancasv
Twitter: JaydithBV

Fátima Blancas is the founder and CEO of iTProve Corporation. For the last fourteen years, she has been a consultant on Microsoft Technology, from SharePoint 2007 to SharePoint Online, Office 365, and Microsoft Teams. She was born and raised, and ... Show more

Luise Freese

Luise Freese

Luise is an Azure & Power Platform Architect based in Germany. She is an awarded Microsoft Most Valuable Professional (MVP) working with organizations that want to move beyond digital theatre. Her focus is on AI-enabled solutions that are designed to last in real-world environments. She helps teams build accessible apps, robust data models, and automation that respects governance, compliance, and human effort. A recurring theme in her work is making the invisible visible: unmeasured work, emotional load, operational friction, and the real cost of “quick wins”. Her motto "Changing the world one app at a time" stems from her extensive work with non-profit organizations.

Alongside client work, Luise writes and speaks about productivity myths, pseudo-agile practices, AI readiness, and why many digital initiatives fail long before technology becomes the problem. She is known for combining clear technical guidance with a sharp eye for organizational patterns; and for asking the uncomfortable questions others tend to avoid.

When not working and traveling, she is a runner, a mother of (teenage) dragons, a LEGO-builder and a lover of the number 42. Her favorite color is #ff69b4. 

Luise is an Azure & Power Platform Architect based in Germany. She is an awarded Microsoft Most Valuable Professional (MVP) working with organizations that want to move beyond digital theatre. Her focus is on AI-enabled solutions that are designed to... Show more

Cathrine Wilhelmsen

Cathrine Wilhelmsen

Cathrine loves data and coding, as well as teaching and sharing knowledge 🤓 She is based in Norway and works as a Data & Analytics Principal Consultant in Evidi, focusing on Data Modeling and Data Integration. Her core skills are Microsoft Fabric, Azure Synapse Analytics, Azure Data Factory, Azure SQL, SQL Server and T-SQL development, but she enjoys everything from programming to data visualization. Outside of work she’s active in the Azure and Microsoft Data communities as a Microsoft Data Platform MVP, international speaker, blogger, organizer, and chronic volunteer. She blogs at cathrinew.net and posts as @cathrinew.net on Bluesky.

Cathrine loves data and coding, as well as teaching and sharing knowledge 🤓 She is based in Norway and works as a Data & Analytics Principal Consultant in Evidi, focusing on Data Modeling and Data Integration. Her core skills are Microsoft Fabric, A... Show more

Madzy Stikkelorum

Madzy Stikkelorum

Madzy is a Data Analytics Consultant at Quanto, organizer of the Power BI Summer School in the Netherlands and former Board Secretary of the Dutch Power BI User Group. With a master’s degree in Mathematics, analyzing data has always been one of her passions, but in the last few years this has extended to organizing events and sharing her knowledge with the community. She does this as a public speaker at conferences, and in blog posts that can be found at https://quanto.eu/blog/.

Madzy is a Data Analytics Consultant at Quanto, organizer of the Power BI Summer School in the Netherlands and former Board Secretary of the Dutch Power BI User Group. With a master’s degree in Mathematics, analyzing data has always been one of her p... Show more

David Rodriguez

David Rodriguez

I'm David Rodriguez, a Spanish Microsoft Regional Director and Azure Microsoft Most Valuable Professional, living in Tenerife, Canary Islands. On 2011, I co-founded Intelequia, a company focused on helping customers to adopt the cloud model, as well as the TenerifeDev user group.

Over the last years I worked at DNN Corp. (a.k.a. DotNetNuke) as the Cloud Team Lead engineer, building Evoq OnDemand and the new microservices architecture for DNN Platform based products and services. I have authored some open source modules for DNN and Azure available at GitHub, allowing to integrate Azure AD, Redis, Application Insights and many other services in the platform.

You can find me organizing the local user group once or twice per month, mainly talking about cloud related matters, and lately on building intelligent apps and bots with cognitive services, and of course, at the Global Azure Bootcamp in Madrid. I don't miss any Microsoft Inspire conference edition, so if you plan to go there we can meet and talk with a cup of coffee. BTW, if you come to the island, I will be happy to show you the best "guachinches" on Tenerife, only local people know the best ones.

I'm David Rodriguez, a Spanish Microsoft Regional Director and Azure Microsoft Most Valuable Professional, living in Tenerife, Canary Islands. On 2011, I co-founded Intelequia, a company focused on helping customers to adopt the cloud model, as well ... Show more

Carmen Huidobro

Carmen Huidobro

Carmen Huidobro is a developer advocate and deved enthusiast. She thrives on lifting others up in their tech careers and loves a good CSS challenge. Always excited to talk about teaching tech, especialmente en Español, oder auf Deutsch.

Carmen Huidobro is a developer advocate and deved enthusiast. She thrives on lifting others up in their tech careers and loves a good CSS challenge. Always excited to talk about teaching tech, especialmente en Español, oder auf Deutsch. Show more

Mete Atamel

Mete Atamel

I’m a Software Engineer and a Developer Advocate at Google in London. I build tools, demos, tutorials, and give talks to educate and help developers to be successful on Google Cloud.

I’m a Software Engineer and a Developer Advocate at Google in London. I build tools, demos, tutorials, and give talks to educate and help developers to be successful on Google Cloud. Show more

Craig Bryden

Craig Bryden

Craig Bryden has been a BI / Data Analytics specialist for over 25 years. Craig is a former Microsoft Data Platform MVP and is the founder of the QLD Power BI and Fabric User Group.

Craig Bryden has been a BI / Data Analytics specialist for over 25 years. Craig is a former Microsoft Data Platform MVP and is the founder of the QLD Power BI and Fabric User Group. Show more

Marcel de Vries

Marcel de Vries

Marcel is the co-founder and Global MD & CTO Xebia Microsoft Services. Xebia Microsoft Services started as an individual company under the Xebia group in 2014 and provides high-end consulting services to companies on Microsoft Azure, DevOps, Cloud Native Software Development, and Managed Services.

Marcel spends most of his time working with organizations to deliver software to production multiple times a day in a secure and compliant way! He helps organizations and leadership teams move to become high-speed, innovative, and productive while still being secure and compliant.

Marcel loves to learn new technologies and use this to advance his customers. He shares his learnings at conferences and training. Marcel has the conviction the CEO title in technology companies should have a second meaning: Coding Executive Officer. This is driven by his strong belief that great leaders in tech need to be technical! Only by staying on top of technology, you can lead the way going forward.

Marcel is a frequently asked public speaker at well-known industry events like Microsoft //Build, Microsoft Ignite, Azure Lowlands, Visual Studio Live!, Techorama, and KCDC, to name a few.

Marcel is part of the Techorama board and helps organize this event in Europe. In his spare time, he also builds online courses for Pluralsight. You can find his courses here: https://app.pluralsight.com/profile/author/marcel-devries

Marcel has been awarded by Microsoft the Microsoft MVP award for more than 17 consecutive years and has been a Microsoft Regional Director since 2008. You can always contact him to talk about subjects like Cloud Adoption Strategies, Business Development, DevOps, Cloud Computing, Microservices, Containers, IaaS, PaaS, and SaaS.

Marcel is the co-founder and Global MD & CTO Xebia Microsoft Services. Xebia Microsoft Services started as an individual company under the Xebia group in 2014 and provides high-end consulting services to companies on Microsoft Azure, DevOps, Cloud Na... Show more

David Pazdera

David Pazdera

Raised and trained as an IT Engineer, transitioned to a solution architect role. Azure MVP, passionate about building tech communities, "security built-in, not bolted on" and "everything as code" principles. You can find my professional bio at https://www.linkedin.com/in/pazdedav/ and my GitHub Profile page at https://github.com/pazdedav

Raised and trained as an IT Engineer, transitioned to a solution architect role. Azure MVP, passionate about building tech communities, "security built-in, not bolted on" and "everything as code" principles. You can find my professional bio at https:... Show more

Kervin Kueny

Kervin Kueny

Curieux de nature, j'accompagne les équipes dans la tempête du changement. Ce n'est pas toujours facile,
et pourtant, cela réserve toujours des moments fantastiques.
Ma devise de grand philosophe : Le cerveau est un organe tellement formidable, que de nos jours, presque tout le monde utilise le sien (Chris Deniaud)

Curieux de nature, j'accompagne les équipes dans la tempête du changement. Ce n'est pas toujours facile, et pourtant, cela réserve toujours des moments fantastiques. Ma devise de grand philosophe : Le cerveau est un organe tellement formidable, qu... Show more

Please note that Sessionize is not responsible for the accuracy or validity of the data provided by speakers.

Most Active Speakers 2023

Every year, we put together a list of the most active speakers. This list features the top 3% of speakers who have participated in events using Sessionize during the 2023.

The 3% is calculated from the pool of all speakers that have at least one accepted session in year 2023. We don't include inactive speakers or speakers that had no accepted sessions during the year. There are around 25 thousand unique accepted speakers this year, the 3% is 771. Not all of them have their speaker profiles set as public, and we respect that, so the list doesn't show all of them.

The calculation is based on the number of accepted events, that's the main criteria, but to get more refined results we also look at things like multiple sessions per event, sharing a session with a co-speaker and how big the event is. Number of submissions and declined sessions don't affect the list.

Please note that the count of events and sessions in this list does not represent the number of events and sessions from the year 2023. Instead, it shows the number of events and sessions featured on the speaker's public speaker profile; these numbers have nothing to do with the award itself.